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The Idle Book Club 11: Fates and Furies

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The Idle Book Club 11:

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Fates and Furies

The first full episode of the new Idle Book Club season tackles Lauren Groff's Fates and Furies, a novel depicting two surprising sides of a marriage—and Sarah and Chris frequently found themselves at odds as well. This battle of the sexes was endorsed by President Obama.

Fates and Furies by Lauren Groff

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I'm about 40% through Fates and Furies. Pretty far from what I usually read but I'm really enjoying it. The writing has a really nice pace to it that just keeps me going.

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Just finished the book, and man am I not wild about some of the plot stuff in the latter half.

 

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  On 1/8/2016 at 8:13 PM, gregbrown said:

Just finished the book, and man am I not wild about some of the plot stuff in the latter half.

 

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This book trades on references to Greek mythology, for better and for worse. I don't think we're meant to see many of the events that happen in the back half as realistic, especially in comparison to what comes before it. In that way, this book really reminds me of A Little Life, another 2015 novel that layers more and more misery on its main character to the point where it becomes comical, but I think that comedy kind of is the point. 

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I for one cannot thank you guys enough for this recomendation. 

 

For me I knew nothing of the book and read thinking it was just his life story and then the doubleswitch!!

 

For me this ranks alongside jean de florette and manon de source as a story that only towards it end really unravels and shows you a completely different view from the initial character.

 

Am now reading Ferrante.

 

Do not go anywhere keep on doing the Book Club, loving it and looking forward to hearing the discussion and to hear everything I missed!!!

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Finally ordered the book, should be here in a few days. Hopefully I will find enough time to finish it in time. Really looking forward to the Podcast as well as the book!

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Just finished up Fates & Furies (contracting mono is real crappy, but it does give you plenty of time to read.  I might finish a few more this month as well...)

I am super excited for the Idle Book Club to return!  It was possibly my favorite podcast when it was going.  The selections and following the books section of the forums transformed my reading choices in general, and I'm looking forward to the upcoming episodes and where they'll lead me.

I have some thoughts about the book, and I want to get them out before my impression fades, but I have lots of thoughts and not a great idea of how to order them.

I loved her prose at times, even sometimes moments that when I process them for a while seem a little cheesy struck me emotionally in flow. I felt most engaged and most impressed by the writing surrounding the couple living their life, and her description of the marriage.  It just resonated with me in a way that most of my favorite writing does.  That said, I think I walked away from the book with a bad taste in my mouth.


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Trying to write about the book made me realize how disorganized my thoughts are about this book.  I am certainly glad I read it, and I enjoyed the experience of reading it, but I don't think I like this book.  I am really interested to hear what others think, and the podcast episode.

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  Quote

She went out at night and picked up men. . . . The boy who sold gas at Stewart's, with his downy moustache and ability to pump for hours like a lonely derrick on the dry Texas Plain

 

*throws book out window*

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  On 1/22/2016 at 3:05 PM, video games said:

*throws book out window*

 

Is that an actual quote from the book??

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Well, at least she didn't settle for a gas pumping reference that was right there, and went for a more ambitious oil pumping reference instead.

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I have the book! Took a while to arrive at my library. How long have I got? Gonna try and finish it before the podxast

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I finished it a couple of days ago and really enjoyed it. I guess I agree with a lot of people here that enjoyed the first half more and wanted more of that, but I think that being aware of the tonal shift made it easier for me to adjust to the change and it ended up being a less drastic change than what I had expected.

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I was interested in the book until I read that quote by video games. Christ.

Ah fuck it, I'll give it a try.

Now will y'all get more PoC writers for the book club? I highly recommend The Book of Night Women by Marlon James or The Moor's Accouny by Laila Lalami or Beauty is a Wound by Eka Kurniawan.

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Nah don't skip it just based on that little bit. Only a few lines in the book bothered me (that one being the worst by far) and like nonintrospection said, there are some parts where the prose is really good.

 

Of course that being said, I had pretty mixed feelings on the book overall haha.

 

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Finished!  Loved the book up until

 

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So, loved, then liked.  Happy to have read it.  :)

 

Question about the bracketed text:

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Also my alma mater is all over this book!  They should have had better fact checking regarding the campus and Poughkeepsie, but otherwise I was happy to fill in the details with my own place-memory.

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If y'all dug the sly narrator in the book, The Children's Hospital by Chris Adrian has a similar narrative voice that's really striking.

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Throughout the opening, I couldn't stop thinking of the opening line of Catcher in the Rye:  "If you really want to hear about it, the first thing you'll probably want to know is where I was born, an what my lousy childhood was like, and how my parents were occupied and all before they had me, and all that David Copperfield kind of crap, but I don't feel like going into it, if you want to know the truth."  I don't know if the life story of Lotto's parents is going to turn out to be relevant, but since I read that line in high school it's felt weird to start a character's backstory this far before their birth.  I sure hope Mathilde gets the same treatment eventually?

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Heh, I've been try to resist posting this, but it's all of think about when working my way through the book, so I'm going to try and purge this demon now and maybe I'll be able to focus on book again. Also, there's really no way to phrase this without sounding like a complete turdman, so I'm just going to go for it.

 

I'm closing in on halfway through the book and ... does it get better? I enjoyed the opening bits, but it's been a parade of increasingly unlikeable characters and uninteresting plot for quite a while now. With the exception of By Blood (and Hemingway, which is just so not my thing), I was totally into the Classic Book Club selections even though they weren't the kind of books I normally read. The praise for Fates & Furies was not insignificant but man, I don't really get it. Maybe there's a turn part of the way through and I just need to hear a "press on, brave one."

 

More details in spoilertown:

 

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  On 2/4/2016 at 12:08 AM, Nelsormensch said:

Heh, I've been try to resist posting this, but it's all of think about when working my way through the book, so I'm going to try and purge this demon now and maybe I'll be able to focus on book again. Also, there's really no way to phrase this without sounding like a complete turdman, so I'm just going to go for it.

 

I'm closing in on halfway through the book and ... does it get better? I enjoyed the opening bits, but it's been a parade of increasingly unlikeable characters and uninteresting plot for quite a while now. With the exception of By Blood (and Hemingway, which is just so not my thing), I was totally into the Classic Book Club selections even though they weren't the kind of books I normally read. The praise for Fates & Furies was not insignificant but man, I don't really get it. Maybe there's a turn part of the way through and I just need to hear a "press on, brave one."

 

More details in spoilertown:

 

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Oh man, you need to read 50 more pages and then see how you feel......

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  On 2/4/2016 at 12:20 AM, Argobot said:

Oh man, you need to read 50 more pages and then see how you feel......

 

Haha, okay, that's good to hear! I wasn't really planning on bailing, but at least now I won't feel like I've got an infinite highway of disinterest ahead of me.

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For what it's worth, things only very briefly improved after those 50 pages as far as I was concerned. I'd still say the book is with finishing, but don't expect too much.

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I agree completely with most of the opinions presented here about the second half of the book. Overall, I'm left ambivalent. If it had been more focused, I think it could have been quite a good book, but the plot just got a bit too ridiculous. Ridiculous plots are all well and good, but it just didn't seem to fit the tone or scope of the novel. Really interested to hear the podcast; I hope you guys will help me think about the book in ways I hadn't considered. 

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  On 2/4/2016 at 12:08 AM, Nelsormensch said:

Heh, I've been try to resist posting this, but it's all of think about when working my way through the book, so I'm going to try and purge this demon now and maybe I'll be able to focus on book again. Also, there's really no way to phrase this without sounding like a complete turdman, so I'm just going to go for it.

 

I'm closing in on halfway through the book and ... does it get better? I enjoyed the opening bits, but it's been a parade of increasingly unlikeable characters and uninteresting plot for quite a while now. With the exception of By Blood (and Hemingway, which is just so not my thing), I was totally into the Classic Book Club selections even though they weren't the kind of books I normally read. The praise for Fates & Furies was not insignificant but man, I don't really get it. Maybe there's a turn part of the way through and I just need to hear a "press on, brave one."

 

More details in spoilertown:

 

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I just finished myself. In general  I wouldn't say I loved it, but I literally just finished a couple hours ago so it's still settling and unfolding.

 

One thing though, in response to your spoilered issues. I didn't realize this until halfway through for obvious semi-spoiler reasons, but even though it seems like an omniscient narrator, it's still basically Lotto's perspective. Maybe not his perspective, since there's still things he wouldn't know (the door sex scene for example), but still his ... outlook. If not through his eyes, then through his rose colored glasses. So it's a bit of an unreliable narrator, not just in the details, but also in the tone and impression of Lotto and what he deserves.  That's why it comes off as so aggrandizing and, in retrospect, dismissive of the rougher edges of their lives. Like for example his shitty friends, I feel like the tone of dealing with them was "yea they have some problems but they're not so bad" but that's because that's how Lotto feels about them, not (i don't think) how we are necessarily supposed to feel about them. 

 

This becomes more obvious once you hop out of Lotto's perspective. I might have wished I had that understanding of the skewed perspective earlier, but I think that's actually one of the things the book is "about". The intersection of individual perspectives, and how strongly your interpretation of events and your own past is influenced by what you imagine of yourself.

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Like how both he and Mathilde are convinced the other is going to leave them. I also found it interesting how Lotto's narcissism was the perfect environment for Mathilde's (and Antoinette's) shadowed manipulations. He just can't conceive of the world not serving him in the ways he expects and when it doesn't (like his injury or learning about Mathilde's past) it completely rocks him because he's so unaccustomed to the blinders coming off.

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I'm only partway through this book, and my main criticism of it has nothing to do with the book itself. It has to do with the way it's written, which is making me think a lot about literary writing in general -- especially literary writing produced by people who have been through MFA programs. Specifically, it brings to the forefront of my mind the facts of the gentrification of creation. Sarah Schulman wrote about the gentrification of creation in her book Gentrification of the Mind, and I'll let her speak to this herself. On "[w]hat counterindicates professionalization programs from real art-making":

 

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One is the homogenization of influences. Students in an MFA program often are exposed to the same ideas and artworks as their classmates. They don't stumble through the world accruing eclectic influences, based on their own aesthetic interests, impulses, and chance. They lose the opportunity to fight to be influenced, to check out weird things and trail after unusual people. This creates homogeneity.

 

As I read this book, I can't help but think I won't remember who wrote it in 2 years. I'll remember it was a woman who wrote it, but probably not which one. Was it Rebecca Schem or Elizabeth Strout? Maybe Patricia Hawkins or Lauren Groff? This isn't really a specific critique of the author, but rather of the system that she is a part of: the professionalized writing industry, which has gentrified cultural production. We only seem to hear from one type of person with one type of writing, and Groff writes in a very MFA voice. I can tell that she's read the Western canon, and that she's adopted the modern "literary" voice. She experiments some, but not in a way that's earnest -- it feels like she experiments in a way that would fit the genre of experimental literature. These aren't bad things in themselves but I've grown tired of them.

 

I'm taking a break from this book, and hope that some distance will rejuvenate my interest in the second half of it. It's got a very strong core and the ideas it plays with are interesting, but its aesthetic is unappealing to me.

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