Bjorn Posted July 1, 2017 We finished Penny Dreadful this evening, and that is a weird show that I both loved and at times disliked so much as to make me want to stop watching it entirely. But ultimately finished it because what it does well, it does so wonderfully well. I have a lot of thoughts about it, but don't know if anyone else has watched it in its entirety? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gwardinen Posted July 1, 2017 On 7/1/2017 at 6:19 AM, Bjorn said: We finished Penny Dreadful this evening, and that is a weird show that I both loved and at times disliked so much as to make me want to stop watching it entirely. But ultimately finished it because what it does well, it does so wonderfully well. I have a lot of thoughts about it, but don't know if anyone else has watched it in its entirety? I watched the first season and definitely had the up and down relationship you described. I didn't end up watching the second season because from the first episode I still felt so unsure of whether I actually liked it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bjorn Posted July 1, 2017 On 7/1/2017 at 7:39 AM, Gwardinen said: I watched the first season and definitely had the up and down relationship you described. I didn't end up watching the second season because from the first episode I still felt so unsure of whether I actually liked it. The weird thing about it is that it vacillates wildly between handling issues around sex, gender and race in interesting and compelling ways, and then will turn around and just indulge in the absolute worst racial stereotypes like a pig rolling around in shit. And then there's the rather persistent religious overtones, of doing god's work to thwart evil while also showing just what a shit and terrible lot humanity has been left by god. And I cannot tell if there is any intentionallity to that at all. By the end I was kind of half rooting for the forces of darkness, because they were at least honest about wanting to destroy the world, while the forces of good just wanted a world full of slaves and misery where they could plug their ears and cover their eyes and pretend they weren't every bit as terrible as what they were fighting. And then the ending is...something. Spoilering I guess in case people are watching it or will watch it. Reveal hidden contents In the end the status quo wins. The British and American empires will continue to grind the world under their boots, which is in some way preferable to either Satan or Dracula doing it for reasons that aren't in the tiniest bit clear. The entire thing about Lilly leading a revolution of battered and abused women is just defused and discarded in a single scene. Vanessa is killed by Ethan. Despite every other goddamned fucking man in the series having some kind of redemption arc, Vanessa isn't allowed one. Lilly isn't allowed one. Justine isn't allowed one. Fucking Frankenstein, who tries to literally turn Lilly into a domesticated, mindless slave gets redemption! Dorian doesn't get redemption, but he returns to his status quo, absolutely nothing is done to him at all. But, the mother of evil can't be redeemed or saved. Which really kind of feels like the message at the end. Women can't be redeemed, and can't be allowed power, under any circumstances. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seamus2389 Posted July 5, 2017 On 7/1/2017 at 6:57 PM, Bjorn said: The weird thing about it is that it vacillates wildly between handling issues around sex, gender and race in interesting and compelling ways, and then will turn around and just indulge in the absolute worst racial stereotypes like a pig rolling around in shit. And then there's the rather persistent religious overtones, of doing god's work to thwart evil while also showing just what a shit and terrible lot humanity has been left by god. And I cannot tell if there is any intentionallity to that at all. By the end I was kind of half rooting for the forces of darkness, because they were at least honest about wanting to destroy the world, while the forces of good just wanted a world full of slaves and misery where they could plug their ears and cover their eyes and pretend they weren't every bit as terrible as what they were fighting. And then the ending is...something. Spoilering I guess in case people are watching it or will watch it. Reveal hidden contents In the end the status quo wins. The British and American empires will continue to grind the world under their boots, which is in some way preferable to either Satan or Dracula doing it for reasons that aren't in the tiniest bit clear. The entire thing about Lilly leading a revolution of battered and abused women is just defused and discarded in a single scene. Vanessa is killed by Ethan. Despite every other goddamned fucking man in the series having some kind of redemption arc, Vanessa isn't allowed one. Lilly isn't allowed one. Justine isn't allowed one. Fucking Frankenstein, who tries to literally turn Lilly into a domesticated, mindless slave gets redemption! Dorian doesn't get redemption, but he returns to his status quo, absolutely nothing is done to him at all. But, the mother of evil can't be redeemed or saved. Which really kind of feels like the message at the end. Women can't be redeemed, and can't be allowed power, under any circumstances. These two articles dig into why it ended the way it did and the problems with the shows Gothic background short changing the characters Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bjorn Posted July 5, 2017 On 7/5/2017 at 10:12 AM, seamus2389 said: These two articles dig into why it ended the way it did and the problems with the shows Gothic background short changing the characters Thanks for those links, they're good pieces and ones I hadn't run across when looking for articles about PD last week. This show really needed a longer 3rd season, or even a fourth season, to let some of the characters and arcs have more breathing room to explored. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
