Twin Peaks Rewatch 52/53: The Return, Parts 17 and 18

[Bob le Samourai]

Perhaps this has all been a ploy to start a weekly, 22-minute-format Jones family sitcom?

[Emily]

You know, I think I'm okay with that being the last of Twin Peaks. If they decide to make more, I'm here for it, but as far as Lynch's work goes I think that was an incredible ending. Maybe not the one I wanted but certainly one that I'll never forget. 

[tragicflounder]

I enjoyed it, the ending was pretty unsettling what with the screaming and all.

Also, right before Carrie screams you can hear a very faint "Laura," I think it's a sound bite from the pilot?

I'm not entirely sure, but I only heard while re-watching the scene with headphones on.

As always, thanks for casting such a wonderful pod Chris and Jake!

[Endofastart]

5 minutes ago, Emily said:

You know, I think I'm okay with that being the last of Twin Peaks. If they decide to make more, I'm here for it, but as far as Lynch's work goes I think that was an incredible ending. Maybe not the one I wanted but certainly one that I'll never forget. 

I completely agree. 

[purps]

1 minute ago, axis1500 said:

I think I view episode 18 as the start of Season 4

Definitely. The main story of this season was we need to put the doppleganger back in the lodge and bring Cooper home. Episode 17 was the ending. There are still some hanging plot threads from earlier in the season but the bulk of it was concluded. Satisfyingly for the most part IMO. 

18 definitely feels like them leaving a door open to continue if they can/want. 

[axis1500]

7 minutes ago, tragicflounder said:

I enjoyed it, the ending was pretty unsettling what with the screaming and all.

Also, right before Carrie screams you can hear a very faint "Laura," I think it's a sound bite from the pilot?

I'm not entirely sure, but I only heard while re-watching the scene with headphones on.

As always, thanks for casting such a wonderful pod Chris and Jake!

 

Sounded like Waldo the bird to me.

[GregsVice]

Twin Peaks simply doesn't conclude. It cannot. 

[SkullKid]

Spoilers for LOST, I guess, but this felt like a very Lynch take on the LOST ending. 

 

During the entire final season, the show cuts between the main story and an alt-world, which appears at first to be an alternate timeline caused by a major event in season 5. It's eventually revealed that this alternate timeline isn't that at all--it's the afterlife, or perhaps the moments *before* the afterlife, taking place outside of time, in the moments before a person passes on. And in this zone, one particular character, Desmond, has the job of "waking up" the castaways. Everybody is living some mundane version of their life before the crash, but when Desmond is able to trigger a memory in a given character, suddenly they realize where they are. They remember all the friendships they made, the tragedies they endured, and the experiences they had with these characters who had a profound impact in their life. 

 

It almost struck me as if Cooper/Richard is a Desmond-like character. He and Diane said that once they entered this "place," things would be different. They didn't know how, but they would be. What happened is they entered a world where Twin Peaks exists, and the characters exist, but in different roles than they had before. RichCoop wanted to "wake up" Laura, so to speak--to trigger her memory of Twin Peaks. And it appears he was able to do that in the final moments of the show. And when she woke up, the entire artifice of this world fell apart. She realized that she didn't know what year it was--that this was some place outside of time, that she was living in some dream. 

 

But who is the dreamer? 

 

My initial gut reaction is that this world is some sort of purgatory. It's where Laura went when she took her face off, revealed the light, and shot up to the sky. She had a Dougie-Coop-esque existence, but once she was awakened? All of her memories of TP unlocked.

 

I think it's safe to say that this is where Audrey was as well. Any time we saw her, it was in alt-Twin Peaks. And when the artifice around her broke, she woke up in *actual* Twin Peaks--maybe in a psych ward, maybe in a hospital, who knows? I'm not saying that the Bang Bang Bar isn't real--I'm saying the version of it we saw in part 16 wasn't real. 

 

Hope that makes some kind of sense.

 

(posted this comment on Reddit too, full disclosure) 

[Gamebeast23456]

I really hope this is it. I do not want anymore. The ending felt like the pure crushing sensation of the last third of Mulholland Drive. All the pain of reality, but also just another dream. I want this to be it. 

[axis1500]

Also worth noting the fireman at the start of this season says "remember Richard and Linda". Seems he knew this would happen.

[SeanMay]

 

 

 

 

[SkullKid]

Also, all of the focus will now be on part 18, but 17 was a lot of fun. Completely edge of your seat, nail biting stuff with BONKERS Twin Peaksyness. I thought the editing, sound design and pacing as Evil Coop makes his way through the station, Chad escapes from his cell, Naido starts going insane, and Good Coop is driving up with the Mitchums was incredibly effective. 

 

I also think people are forgetting a crucial moment: after BOB and Evil Coop are destroyed, we see the clock stop moving (maybe at 2:53? I can't recall), and we also see this visage of Cooper's frozen face on the screen. It's this super happy moment, all of the main cast reunited in the iconic Sheriff's station. But time seems to freeze. I like to think that the ensuing 90 minutes take place all in that frozen instant of time. We got our happy ending, everyone was reunited, but Cooper also went on this insane journey to save Laura Palmer from Alt Texas, all in that moment. 

[Gamebeast23456]

1 minute ago, SkullKid said:

Also, all of the focus will now be on part 18, but 17 was a lot of fun. Completely edge of your seat, nail biting stuff with BONKERS Twin Peaksyness. I thought the editing, sound design and pacing as Evil Coop makes his way through the station, Chad escapes from his cell, Naido starts going insane, and Good Coop is driving up with the Mitchums was incredibly effective. 

 

I also think people are forgetting a crucial moment: after BOB and Evil Coop are destroyed, we see the clock stop moving (maybe at 2:53? I can't recall), and we also see this visage of Cooper's frozen face on the screen. It's this super happy moment, all of the main cast reunited in the iconic Sheriff's station. But time seems to freeze. I like to think that the ensuing 90 minutes take place all in that frozen instant of time. We got our happy ending, everyone was reunited, but Cooper also went on this insane journey to save Laura Palmer from Alt Texas, all in that moment. 

 

The Cooper face was such a brilliant way of making the triumphant scene feel portentous and perilous. 

[Aether]

Just now, anoldtoilet said:

thats weird because i loved it and im pretty sure lynch wanted me to love it. the ending was perfect. if we get more, sure, whatever, it'll be cool, but it could end forever now and I'd be satisfied. That was perfect.

 

definitely glad you liked it, i think by design it will be hitting different people in different ways. and i'm with you about the show possibly ending, I'd prefer it be over, though we probably feel that way for different reasons.

[UnpopularTrousers]

So, I think episode 17 was the most deliberately reductive good versus evil superhero fight imaginable, and episode 18 argued that such a dichotomy doesn't exist. The Cooper of episode 18  was neither good Coop nor bad Coop, he was just Coop. And he used his power to force Diane to have sex with him. I think when the evilness of Bob was destroyed, it was actually the false dichotomy of good and evil being destroyed giving us a world where everyone is both.

 

Or at least that was what my gut was telling me was happening on an emotional level. I can justify it at all, and I need more than a couple of minutes to figure out what the fuck I just saw in terms of actual plot.

[Gamebeast23456]

Also, that whole Diane/Coop / Richard/Linda sex scene was absolutely terrifying. One of the most understated horror scenes I've ever seen. His eyes are just empty in that scene. 

 

I really agree with the previous comment about the destruction of our assumed dichotomies by part 18. I think the podcast guys were getting a little exasperated with the moral universe and perceived one-noteness of how The Return handled morality, but the finale totally wrecks that all, it seems to me. 

[anderbubble]

I haven't thought this through much yet; but I wanted to at least get it out there.

 

I think the ending might be about the border between the reality of Twin Peaks in the show and the reality of the real world itself.

 

The first thing I though this about was when  Leland says "find Laura"; who does Cooper go find immediately? Laura Dern.

 

Then, they go to Sarah Palmer's house. Who do they find? The literal person who actually owns the house in real life.

[anderbubble]

Just now, anoldtoilet said:

They found a Lodge spirit. Mrs Tremond/Chalfont. 

 

But she's played by Mary Reber, who apparently literally owns the house in real life.

 

http://twinpeaks.wikia.com/wiki/Mary_Reber

 

https://www.heraldnet.com/news/theres-a-little-mystery-and-a-whole-lot-of-screaming-at-twin-peaks-house/

[UnpopularTrousers]

2 minutes ago, anderbubble said:

 

But she's played by Mary Reber, who apparently literally owns the house in real life.

 

http://twinpeaks.wikia.com/wiki/Mary_Reber

 

https://www.heraldnet.com/news/theres-a-little-mystery-and-a-whole-lot-of-screaming-at-twin-peaks-house/

Dose that mean that part of the show exists purely in TV land, and another part exists in place that combines TV land with reality? Like how Jim Belushi is an actor, but Monica Bellucci is just Monica Bellucci? I mean, probably not.

[richardco]

My brain is a jumble right now, so this post is going to be too.

 

That was EXACTLY what I wanted. My greatest fear going into the finale was that they were going to tie everything up with a neat little bow. 

The reason that Twin Peaks and FWWM endured for so many years--for me at least--was that the series lore seemed to make some kind of sense in a way that I could never grasp. This finale keeps the mystery going. There are so many questions.

 

*What happened to Audrey?

*What the hell was Gotta Light even about?

*Is it future or is it past?

 

Fuck, I loved this so much. I can't remember the last time I've been so completely satisfied after watching a series/movie etc.

 

Just some fun food for thought: Jeffries shows Cooper the number 8 which resembles a mobius strip, a theory that people love to force on everyone of Lynch's movies. Thought that was pretty funny.

 

The episode itself was incredible.Cooper definitely didn't seem like Cooper after he came out of the lodge. His face during the sex scene was really unsettling. And I love how quietly terrifying that whole last episode was. Diane seeing herself by the hotel lobby and then it was somehow scarier when in the next frame she wasn't there any longer. Then Cooper (Richard?) comes out of a different hotel and gets in a different car. And the whole night drive back to Twin Peaks was so scary. I'm going to be thinking about this for a long, long time. Fucking brilliant. 

 

Also, everyone should put everything on Youtube. Maybe David Lynch will make you a hero someday. Freddie was fantastic.

[GregsVice]

Jerry walked, like, 500 miles. Haha.

[plasticflesh]

Episode 17 seems to be the ending of the original canon of Twin Peaks, exiting the goofy soap opera world of former Twin Peaks for good, as represented by the awesome and over the top boxing match between Freddie and BOB. (as observed in this thread)

 

Episode 18 is entering a darker, weirder world of Twin Peaks, an even more surreal and horrific Lost Highway dream world. This might be the actual doppleganger to the good world of Twin Peaks. Where original Twin Peaks world had a consistent and goofy soap opera reality and a dichotomous good and evil; RichardCoop Twin Peaks world has eerie and quiet world of bland cowboys and home owners.

 

So if it's about Cooper chasing down Judy/Jowdy/Mother, as Frenden says, Mother created a new dream to obfuscate and hide. (as observed in this thread)

 

It's interesting the parallels between the ending of 18 as Carrie awakening from her nightmare, 17 of Cooper awaking from his Twin Peaks dream, and 16 as Audrey waking up from her Charlie and Roadhouse nightmare.

 

These are all distinct realities/dreams but with different flavors of the same person in each one. Ultimately it's human pawns trying to chase down the Jowdy/Mother lodge spirit. But to what end? What happens when they get to that? Maybe that's the point, there is no ending to the dream, or at least no awareness of what the outside of the dream would even look like to the dreamers.

[UnpopularTrousers]

Quote

Albert: You've gone soft in your old age.
Cole: Not where it counts,  buddy!

 

Never has an empty sexual boast so encapsulated two confounding hours of television. 

[richardco]

1 minute ago, UnpopularTrousers said:

 

Never has an empty sexual boast so encapsulated two confounding hours of television. 

 

Well said.

[plasticflesh]

I also think the lyrics of the Roadhouse credits songs all have pretty direct significance to the events of that episode, for the episodes that have such lyrics.

 

For example, episode 17 has Julee Cruise singing, "love, don't go away, come back and stay, always forever ... the world spins" this is a reflection that the old world love of Twin Peaks is gone forever, and the world spins into its new encarnation of even weirder Richard/Linda/Judy dream world.