Three Moves Ahead Episode 504: Troy and Kingdom of Heaven

[Rob Zacny]

Three Moves Ahead 504:

Troy and Kingdom of Heaven
Rob and Troy are walking the battlements as they revisit Wolfgang Peterson's "Troy" and Ridley Scott's director's cut of "Kingdom of Heaven". What do these two movies about major siege-battles fought between clashing civilizations, from the early years of the War on Terror, say about their moment? Is Troy underrated, overrated, or correctly rated? Why is Brendan Gleeson so unsettling? All these questions and more are answered this week on Three Moves Ahead.

Troy, Kingdom of Heaven

 

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[Khan Khomrad]

I really enjoy this format of Rob and Troy picking two movies that are thematically related and talking about them. I wonder if you guys will get around to cover Kagemusha and Ran one of these days.

 

Funnily enough one of the best castle siege games out there is Nobunaga's ambition: Sphere of Influence. In that game sieges are all about beating your opponent's army while still having enough men to besiege and take castles, or outmaneuver armies and capture castles. That and the Hegemony series. I'm afraid there aren't many other good castle siege/defense games out there, unfortunately.

 

P.S: So, at the end Rob calls Leana T. J Hafer (her former name). This makes me wonder if: A) this episode had been recorded and edited a while back and was only just released for whatever reason, or B ) Rob mistakenly called her by her former name and they left that in.

[ilitarist]

Love those shows.

 

I've recently watched Troy Director's Cut and I was surprised about how... average it is. All of its subversion feel very much a child of its time. I'd like to see honest by the book recreation of Illiad, maybe Netflix TV show Troy mentioned is better. But here there are no gods and it's all down to earth. The siege is very short and it's really about geopolitics, not a stolen wife. I see everything Troy says about Achilles but I just can't take him seriously. My biggest issue with both Troy and Kingdom of Heaven is those films try to tell us that back then almost all people were just like us and people who seriously talk about faith and honor are either dumb or hypocritical. Kingdom of Heaven is a proud STEM master race, of course he doesn't really believe in holy wars and church in general, and so doesn't Saladin. He's like someone from the future. Same for Achilles, he's an edgy atheist and it's bizzare.

 

I agree that Priam and Achilles dialogue is good but outside of it I don't see the emotions I expect from Achilles. There's little rage in him, he's always a modern bad cop archetype. Subdued emotions. When he fights it's a dance, his style is to concentrate on movements with no emotions. I don't get it.

[Rob Zacny]

  On 9/15/2020 at 12:09 AM, Khan Khomrad said:

P.S: So, at the end Rob calls Leana T. J Hafer (her former name). This makes me wonder if: A) this episode had been recorded and edited a while back and was only just released for whatever reason, or B ) Rob mistakenly called her by her former name and they left that in.

Hey, this is Len posting on Rob's account (because I never actually made a forum account).

Yeah, this was recorded a while ago and I told him it was fine. I didn't want to have to make someone re-record the outro or anything. I edited it so if I'd had a problem with it, obviously, I could have done something about it. Appreciate the concern though!

[Khan Khomrad]

  On 10/9/2020 at 3:28 AM, Rob Zacny said:

Hey, this is Len posting on Rob's account (because I never actually made a forum account).

Yeah, this was recorded a while ago and I told him it was fine. I didn't want to have to make someone re-record the outro or anything. I edited it so if I'd had a problem with it, obviously, I could have done something about it. Appreciate the concern though!

 

Got it!