Alternative perspectives of Liberty City

[clyde]

So I've played GTA IV and I've finished The Ballad of Gay Tony. Right now I'm about 50% through The Lost and Damned. I'm interested in how you all react to the integration of each episode's story with the others. Obviously, the nature of this forum post is pretty spoilery so stop reading if you don't want to know. Take the blue pill. 

I don't play these games for the story, but I wouldn't play them if they didn't have a story (unless they replaced it with something like Mount&Blade's systemic political vibe). But since they have a story which motivates me to play through them, I end up thinking about the narrative and its structure. 
When I finished GTA IV, I had very little idea of what had happened beyond Nico reluctantly getting caught up in the Liberty City crime-layer and experiencing a cascade of debt (not necessarily financial) which further invested him in the crime-layer. Bad things happened as a result. When I played The Ballad of Gay Tony, the appearance of characters from Nico's story seemed like an acknowledgement that I had played the original game. I thought that was cool. Additionally, it wasn't until I played through The Ballad of Gay Tony that I realized that the diamond deal was supposed to be a major point in the story. I really enjoyed getting another perspective of what had happened and the people involved. I couldn't quite wrap my head around what had actually happened because I didn't remember who did what in the original game because I wasn't really paying attention to the diamond stuff in the first place. I did really get a kick out of being the person who kidnapped Gracie though. 

Now I'm playing through The Lost and the Damned and the broader picture of the heroin deal has been presented, but again, I can't remember what happened in the other games clearly enough to really get the full picture. The same is going on with the diamonds. My memory is capable of going "Oh cool, it's the guy from the other game," and "Oh Yeah! I kinda remember this happening in the other game."

 

I remember the first time I saw Pulp Fiction, I was blown away. It's been a while, but I remember that it presents alternative perspectives on the same events. Be forgiving of my additional examples, because I remember "ishness" more than actual details: Films like Magnolia and Slacker and Red Violin seem to imply a web of causation through alternate perspectives of similar events or through various contexts in which different characters use the same item. I don't know the name for this technique, but it's totally a thing.
It really turns me off in films, but I like it in games. In films it seems gimmicky to me. In games, the technique seems. . . ambitious. I think that the difference for me is that I am playing as the character who has the alternate motivation and context. There is certainly some dissonance in my motives as a player and those of the character within the narrative (not to mention the dissonance between my intentions and my level of control), but the attempts to lead my player actions into a crux that can dove-tail into that of my precious or future player actions within a different story is intriguing. I feel bad that I can't actually realize how it all comes together. Like I typed before, I just get excited about seeing Elizabeta again; I don't remember what types of alliances she has with Ray or Marcus or whoever. The implied network of causation between these characters and their actions does suggest a paradigm of small-worlds and social spheres that I find interesting, but I don't have the memory capacity to actually figure out what RockStar is saying about them. For all I know, these three Episodes could be someone's treatise on how debt within a social sphere tends to create more debt; or how social spheres depend on competition within itself in order to survive within a larger world.  I just can't track it. 
I'm interested in your thoughts on what this intermingling of characters, contexts and motivations within the GTA IV games is trying to communicate and what it actually does communicate.But  I'm not intending to limit this discussion to the GTA world. If you know of other games that present alternative contexts to in game events in characters in order to display meaning, please contribute. 

[mikemariano]

You're correct that Rockstar didn't add any meaning to the diamond deal as they added multiple perspectives.  It felt like the same slog through a museum three times.  I thought it was also a cheap dodge to make all three of the playable characters essentially "innocent" in the bloodshed.  These shootouts just sorta happen, I guess!

 

I mentioned this in the Fallout: New Vegas thread, but I was reluctant to side with Mr. House against the Brotherhood of Steel because they were the good guys in Fallout 3.  How could I betray the warm, fuzzy techno-theocrats who gave me Liberty Prime?  Even though I was a different character, my perspective of the Brotherhood of Steel was permanently colored by having played Fallout 3 first.

[Thrik]

The best example of this for me is Opposing Force, the first and best Half-Life expansion that had you dropping into the facility as one of the very same soldiers sent there to kill the character you played as in the main game plus all the aliens, etc.

It was handled incredibly well, going so far as to let you watch Gordon Freeman elude you by a mere moment as he does something you did in the main game. Seeing Black Mesa from another perspective was also brilliant, making a vast facility seem even vaster.

That is the kind of thing I'd love to see more of. I'm really hoping Rockstar makes use of the opportunity for three-way interaction they've got in GTA5, I can see them having you do things as one character which then opens up missions for another where you go to that same place in the aftermath of whatever madness ensued before.

[clyde]

That is the kind of thing I'd love to see more of. I'm really hoping Rockstar makes use of the opportunity for three-way interaction they've got in GTA5, I can see them having you do things as one character which then opens up missions for another where you go to that same place in the aftermath of whatever madness ensued before.

 

Imagine if they did this by actually recording the game states during your playthrough, and then played it back. For example, during a car chase, the game records the details like a Halo 3 match (where you can later fly around and see what happened) and then when you play through that scenario in another perspective it replayed that. Actually, that's not a perfect idea, because it massively limits interaction in the second playthrough. A car that crashes into a hotdog stand in the first playthrough can't be crushed by you first. If you did, then a paradox would occur and you would slowly turn invisible. Photographs of family members in the bedrooms where you save your game would fade away slowly, until you correct the contradiction.