Jake Posted July 24, 2013 Or: The Rise and Fall and Rise of Ragnar the Gardener Idle Thumbs 116: Ragnar Calls It Quits As Ragnar got up to answer the knock at his door, he thought of his life. He'd been chancellor of the realm (for a day), he'd aided the king himself in a secret plot (though that hadn't gone so well), then he'd helped win a war (that he didn't want to fight). Ups and downs, sure, but it was enough -- a life to be proud of. But under the rule of these lot enough is never enough. It was time to go back, time for one final job. Stepping out unto the midnight air he took one last look at his begonias and headed east. Games Discussed: Crusader Kings II, The Binding of Isaac, Sir, You Are Being Hunted, Star Wars: Rebellion Listen on the Episode Page Listen in iTunes Subscribe to the RSS Feed Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Codicier Posted July 24, 2013 That howl of realisation at the end of the cast sounded so full of anguish I feel really like it should have been delivered at the end of a 80's action film with Nick falling to his knees in the rain cradling a laptop with copy of his live journal on it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Henroid Posted July 24, 2013 I like how Nick went from saying Rebellion was a terrible game to saying it was good. Empire at War was really weird. It seemed to just be an RTS more than anything. They added ground battles and changed space battles to operate like simple RTS games. All the galaxy management stuff got removed. It was not what I was expecting, and not what I wanted, but the game was advertised as being similar to Rebellion. I felt lied to. If Rebellion got modernized it could actually be a great game. The "tactical" battles (space battles) and their interface are very unwieldy. When one is triggered, the game offers you a quick-result button just to rock-paper-scissors things, so I use that all the time. Aside from cleaning up the UI that's the big thing that needs fixing. People apparently complained that planetary assaults (ground battles) are always handled in that automatic fashion, but I guess someone (when making EAW) interpreted that as "oh people want an RTS." I do have another story about Rebellion; one of the conditions to win the game is taking over the enemy's headquarters. The Empire's HQ is Coruscant, and the Rebel HQ can move around like a ship. When you find the Rebel HQ you can sabotage it with commandos or assault the planet or bomb it. Those are the logical means you would accomplish this goal. But I found a new way to do this by accident and I can't come up with a narrative reasoning for it. One of the things you can do with your special agents is incite uprisings; this is a means of shifting the Popularity bar for planets you don't control. As a bonus, you get bits of information about the planet, like who is there, what military forces or manufacturing facilities are present, etc. I was sending out groups of commandos all over the galaxy to turn Rebel controlled planets to neutral. As one of the planets was nearing the point of neutrality, the informants told me it was the Rebel HQ. I was prepping a fleet to send that way, and suddenly the cinematic for destroying the Rebel HQ plays. I see the message about the planet going neutral in favor to either side. I thought, up until now, that the Rebel HQ would merely relocate to the nearest friendly planet (which is what happens if a fleet retreats from battle). Turns out it just gets blown up somehow. Also Nick is correct and incorrect about the game alerting you about every little thing that happens. It is definitely annoying. But you can right click R2-D2 or the Imperial counterpart and uncheck what types of alerts it should give you. You can also right-click C-3P0 / his Imperial counterpart and have them not translate the other droid for you. Which actually isn't necessary at all. If you get a manufacturing message, the droid beeps and boops are always the same for that. Popularity related messages? They have their own sound. What made it worse was that the translator droids didn't even have different ways of telling you what was said. "A manufacturing message has been received." That's it, no other way to interpret. It gets extremely repetitive. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Video Games Are Childish Posted July 25, 2013 how can you say crusader kings 2 is just intolerably unfriendly and some achievement to get into and then go praise that star wars game, or apologize for it? crusader kings 2 is complex but at least has a sublime UI, and other than knowing the systems, isn't actually that difficult... like if i had a strategy novice, or a newbie, and had to pick one of those games for them, hoping they'd "get" it and not kill themselves, it'd be CK2 no doubt, so i don't see why that is presented here so ominously Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chris Posted July 25, 2013 On 7/25/2013 at 4:32 AM, Video Games Are Childish said: how can you say crusader kings 2 is just intolerably unfriendly and some achievement to get into and then go praise that star wars game, or apologize for it? crusader kings 2 is complex but at least has a sublime UI, and other than knowing the systems, isn't actually that difficult... like if i had a strategy novice, or a newbie, and had to pick one of those games for them, hoping they'd "get" it and not kill themselves, it'd be CK2 no doubt, so i don't see why that is presented here so ominously Is this being directed at the podcast? If so, was it the same person who actually said both things you are referring to? Your post doesn't really line up with what I think our actual expressed opinions to be. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gormongous Posted July 25, 2013 On 7/25/2013 at 4:32 AM, Video Games Are Childish said: how can you say crusader kings 2 is just intolerably unfriendly and some achievement to get into and then go praise that star wars game, or apologize for it? crusader kings 2 is complex but at least has a sublime UI, and other than knowing the systems, isn't actually that difficult... like if i had a strategy novice, or a newbie, and had to pick one of those games for them, hoping they'd "get" it and not kill themselves, it'd be CK2 no doubt, so i don't see why that is presented here so ominously You're kidding, right? I love Crusader Kings II to death and actually think it's more accessible than it looks, but the UI is hardly "sublime." Basic usability features like "embark all" are still missing after a year and the discoverability of UI elements like plots is next to nil. It's hard to see from the inside, but this game is pretty unfriendly, even compared to something like Star Wars: Rebellion. It's no Victoria, I still have nightmares about that UI, but I still wouldn't risk any newbie with it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Justin Leego Posted July 25, 2013 On 7/24/2013 at 10:56 PM, Henroid said: If Rebellion got modernized it could actually be a great game. The "tactical" battles (space battles) and their interface are very unwieldy. I read this as "space (space) battles" Congratulations on altering my grammatical ruleset. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TychoCelchuuu Posted July 25, 2013 Oh man, can't wait to listen to this one - Star Wars: Rebellion is one of those games that I love but that most people are mediocre or unhappy about. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Henroid Posted July 25, 2013 By the way in case anyone hasn't seen it yet, majesty: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
melmer Posted July 25, 2013 I had never even heard of that game before i read the podcasts description. had to google it was greeted with a middling gamespot review from 1998 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Arassar Posted July 25, 2013 You said the magic word: SPEEDRUN!!! So I am here to shill for the Summer Games Done Quick 2013 Marathon, presented by Speed Demos Archive. They're collecting donations for the next 5 days, all proceeds going to Doctors Without Borders. Even if you don't donate, it's still really fun to watch. The schedule is posted here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Roderick Posted July 25, 2013 What a fantastic chronicle! I hadn't seen the stream, but Ragnar's rise and fall is just amazing. One thing I want to bring up, since I've also heard this on the 3MA podcast. It seems you both pronounce the word 'grognard' fonetically (from an American standpoint) - literally a combination of grog and nard. Considering its French origins, wouldn't a more accurate pronunciation be 'grohn-yaar'? I hesitate to nag about relatively inane stuff like this, but since grognard is such a specific loanword from a very specific French idea, it's weird to use it but not pronounce it anything like the original. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Badfinger Posted July 25, 2013 On 7/24/2013 at 10:56 PM, Henroid said: I like how Nick went from saying Rebellion was a terrible game to saying it was good. Well, he's right! I LOVED that game. Funny enough, even though it got middling reviews in general, my most central outlet for reviews and opinions was Computer Games Strategy Plus (Computer Games Magazine) and they gave it 4 and a half stars out of 5. So fuck yes I bought that thing. Yep, the UI was terrible and the battles were bad (but fun), but there were some really neat grand strategy elements. I think the craziest thing didn't even get mentioned - a huge part of the game was recruiting and assigning named characters from the Star Wars universe. So for example, as the Rebellion you get Luke Skywalker and Han and Chewbacca, Leia, etc, but you can also recruit like 30 Expanded Universe characters and they could be generals or admirals or starfighter commanders or spies or saboteurs. And then at some point in the middle of the game, Luke Skywalker, your probably best admiral leading a fleet, says I HAVE TO GO BE A JEDI and disappears to Dagobah and comes back as a Jedi Knight and then if he goes on missions with other dudes they can potentially be force sensitive and be trained as Jedi. 200 planets. You can play Empire vs Rebellion and have a map with 200 planets. The polygonal models were terrible for the Total War-style battles, but at the same time - the imagined battle of 10-20 squadrons of fighters having dogfights over capital ships giving each other broadsides was incredible. So, terribly awesome. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lu Posted July 25, 2013 I bought that game as a little kid! I totally had a Star Wars phase in which I mindlessly collected everything that had the Star Wars title. (I bought Force Commander too...) I never did get a whole lot of the 3D space fights, but I put so many hours into that thing... I don't think I ever had any idea what I was doing though. On 7/25/2013 at 11:24 AM, Arassar said: You said the magic word: SPEEDRUN!!! So I am here to shill for the Summer Games Done Quick 2013 Marathon, presented by Speed Demos Archive. They're collecting donations for the next 5 days, all proceeds going to Doctors Without Borders. Even if you don't donate, it's still really fun to watch. The schedule is posted here. Whoa! Has it already been a year? I only found out about this thing last year and it's bucket loads of fun to watch. Absolutely insane stuff. Those folks have a level of mastery on the games they play, it's really impressive to watch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Henroid Posted July 25, 2013 On 7/25/2013 at 2:30 PM, Badfinger said: Well, he's right! I LOVED that game. Funny enough, even though it got middling reviews in general, my most central outlet for reviews and opinions was Computer Games Strategy Plus (Computer Games Magazine) and they gave it 4 and a half stars out of 5. So fuck yes I bought that thing. Yep, the UI was terrible and the battles were bad (but fun), but there were some really neat grand strategy elements. I think the craziest thing didn't even get mentioned - a huge part of the game was recruiting and assigning named characters from the Star Wars universe. So for example, as the Rebellion you get Luke Skywalker and Han and Chewbacca, Leia, etc, but you can also recruit like 30 Expanded Universe characters and they could be generals or admirals or starfighter commanders or spies or saboteurs. And then at some point in the middle of the game, Luke Skywalker, your probably best admiral leading a fleet, says I HAVE TO GO BE A JEDI and disappears to Dagobah and comes back as a Jedi Knight and then if he goes on missions with other dudes they can potentially be force sensitive and be trained as Jedi. 200 planets. You can play Empire vs Rebellion and have a map with 200 planets. The polygonal models were terrible for the Total War-style battles, but at the same time - the imagined battle of 10-20 squadrons of fighters having dogfights over capital ships giving each other broadsides was incredible. So, terribly awesome. I started a round of it a couple weeks ago, and on the first day Darth Vader sent a message saying two people he was with are Force sensitive and should train with him. Finding a Force sensitive character in a game is uncommon enough, but on the first day AND two characters at once? I hit some sort of lotto. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Badfinger Posted July 25, 2013 On 7/25/2013 at 2:57 PM, Lu said: I bought that game as a little kid! I totally had a Star Wars phase in which I mindlessly collected everything that had the Star Wars title. (I bought Force Commander too...) I never did get a whole lot of the 3D space fights, but I put so many hours into that thing... I don't think I ever had any idea what I was doing though. Force Commander was HORRIBLE. :[ Sadly, there were no charmingly terrible redeeming qualities about that. It was just hideous. Even as an RTS + Star Wars fan, I couldn't make it more than about 2 hours before I gave up forever. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
elmuerte Posted July 25, 2013 I'm really looking forward to Sir, You Are Being Hunted. I also backed it, but not for the alpha tier. You should do a weekend Stream of it. I don't like the fact that you Stream in the middle of the night :/ http://breckon.livejournal.com/? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gormongous Posted July 25, 2013 On 7/25/2013 at 5:02 PM, elmuerte said: http://breckon.livejournal.com/? Yeah, that's what I thought too, but I wanted to gather more evidence before making an accusation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikemariano Posted July 25, 2013 I'm pretty sure Nick's birthday isn't the same day as my birthday, so this is probably a different Breckon. And check out that comment from 2012! Quote Just a bit of desperation to find and old friend. Who knows, this may still go to an e-mail you check. SnowVDemon, your Princess misses you! Searching for SnowVDemon opens an entire world I'd rather avoid. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
elmuerte Posted July 25, 2013 the mentioned AOL handle is ShenchouNick333, so it's a Nick Breckon. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gormongous Posted July 25, 2013 On 7/25/2013 at 6:25 PM, elmuerte said: the mentioned AOL handle is ShenchouNick333, so it's a Nick Breckon. There's also a comment on another Livejournal where a user calls him Nick. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikemariano Posted July 25, 2013 https://twitter.com/excite_mike/status/284684049979686913 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Codicier Posted July 25, 2013 On 7/25/2013 at 6:09 PM, mikemariano said: I'm pretty sure Nick's birthday isn't the same day as my birthday, so this is probably a different Breckon. And check out that comment from 2012! Searching for SnowVDemon opens an entire world I'd rather avoid. either way he has no incentive to confirm or deny it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gormongous Posted July 25, 2013 On 7/25/2013 at 7:13 PM, mikemariano said: https://twitter.com/excite_mike/status/284684049979686913 Oh man, there we go. Congratulations all around, everyone. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nick Breckon Posted July 25, 2013 Goddamn you, ALL OF YOU. I let Chris keep that in there and THIS IS HOW YOU REPAY ME? In all honesty, there are probably some weird things I could talk about on the next cast related to this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
